The battery builders club

Looks can be deceiving with welds, the only way to know for sure is to try and tear it off.

You should end up with the welded spots tearing the unwelded nickel, and you usually end up with some nice vicious spiky bits of nickel left on the cell if your welds are good.

Another thing to note is that it’s advisable to avoid welding near the center of the negative terminal. There’s stuff and things inside the shell that can be damaged by welding in the centre of some cells.

The rule of thumb that I go by is that each single (good) weld spot should be good for about 5 amps continuous. For most packs I do 3 sets of welds per terminal.

The only other thing i’ll mention is that the nickel looks a little anaemic…

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I feel like you need more nickel first, before you can add more welds.

Your question is too vague. What are you using the pack for? What kind of construction method? How much current?

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It would be a continuous sheet. I have a continuous roll thats cut from, not just squares :slight_smile:

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Been out the game for a bit looking at building new battery pack for a small commuter board any cells I should be looking at.

I use to use
Out dated r25
All rounders Sony VTC6/Samsung Q30
higher discharge VTC5a
Molie cell P26a was the new kid last time I looked.

P42A larger 2170 cells

Any new ones come out I should look in to before buying?

Edit: seems molicel only ones developing
P28a replaced P26a
P45b replaces p42a

Lishen 2170LA’s are about 15% worse performing than Moli’s P42a but cost about 30-50% less. I have 2 12s6ps with them and I really enjoy them.

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If you’re crazy focused on weight, the options I’d look at specifically would be:

  • LiFePo4, maybe A123 if you can get your hands on them. Juice them up with like a 5-8A charger, you’ll only have 80-120Wh to work with but given it can be charged in 20 minutes, that may suite your needs. You’ll have way more power than Liion, for the same weight. Some can be gotten for REALLY low prices too, I know @hummieee had them for sale for a while
  • If you want more range and don’t really mind having a less powerful board, just use P42A. The pack is small anyway so no point using lower power cells which will sag like hell toward the end of the ride.

You can consider the higher capacity ones, LG M50LT etc. but they’re really lower power, you should only consider a single motor. Assuming this board is situational and you have a larger one you know you’ll take when you’re out riding longer, I’d go for LiFePo4 for the power and charge speed.

Yes they’re lighter but thay take up more space there have better cycle life but you suffer in performance in discharge amps and sag.

Only use them if life span of battery pack is your main gole (about 2-3 times the life span) I fined the max discharge volt sag main issue on any board up to 4p. Unless the chemistry has made a big leap.

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You can use 14S2P A123 ANR26650M1B
4500W continuous nominal power, 224Wh, 2.13KG Cell weight, 20 Minutes charge time @ 15A

P42A with the same weight would be
3400w continuous nominal power, 483Wh, 2.12KG Cell weight, 1.2 Hour charge time @ 15A

Theres disadvanatages and advantages to each… The A123 would potentially end up a LOT cheaper to build though.

Edit: also the space would be roughly the same between that comparison

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Thanks for the info I did not know about the welding on the center of negatives
What do you mean by the nickel looks anaemic? is 0.2 by 8mm

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It’s very small. The smallest I’ve ever used on an esk8 pack is 10mm

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A 12s 2p. 40 amp continuous. arranged in a 3x4 configuration. using the pack for motorized rollerblades. the pack will be in hard shell box.

How are you planning on connecting your series links?

That nickel is wayyyy too small to handle 40A on its own - it’s good for maybe 20A, and I wouldn’t personally push it that hard.

My mistake I was confusing my self with the CR123 LifePo4. Short stubby cell boosted boards use to use A123 50a-70a discharge some thing I’d need to look in to more but thay are a big 26mm diameter so not a real comparison vs 2170 or 18650 cells as ther double the area of the 18650. Up side is thay are a more stable safer chemistry.

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You could even throw Headway cells into the mix… Youd need at least 14 of them for good voltage, but they literally charge at effectively any pace, you could easily charge them well within spec at 50 amps for a 15 minute charge time 0 to 100… Of course a 50A charger would weigh more than the board but don’t write off LiFePo4

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A shame the lifepo4 K2 26650 with 3800mah is no more. It was in a league of its own and up to lithium-ion energy density.

I found it was made by Trojan who make lifepo4 car batteries. The potential for an energy dense lifepo4 is doable and they were even cheap … why is it gone?l

Someone said has voltage sag. I see it having the opposite in that it can kick out big amps without sagging. And it has a nice flat discharge curve. Besides all it’s other attributes and resilience, and safety. Under appreciated

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Board isn’t functional as of recent but i just got around to following what you said, and over 2 days watched the 0.075 difference go to 0.020. Cells sitting at 4.1v. I gave it another 20-minute charge and the voltage difference shot back up 0.071

Voltage is now at ~4.16 (0.060 difference) and watching it slowly balance back. Its discharging the 17/18 packs back down to match the single lowest p-group.

haven’t been able to discharge it like you said, as the board won’t be running due to belts until at least next week

Question….
Where do you guys buy your battery building supplies?? Fish paper, nickel strips, kapton tape, silicon insulated balance wire?

Duckbatterysystems.com for the raw supplies, don’t use silicone insulated balance wires, just use the stuff that comes with the bms.

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First I’ve heard, what’s the reason for that?

No reason, the stuff that they come with is sufficient

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