I battle hardened the half of the motor’s can that was for some reason neglected and put back the broken magnet which luckily snapped into place. I used araldite 2014 epoxy adhesive and baked at around 75C. Check data sheets most are heat resistant and strong but not at the same time. (Trying to hit keywords for ppl googling for epoxies)
I know the 63100s had issues snapping magnets off the can so hopefully this should let me get happy with the acceleration before ripping them off. Still won’t max out the Ubox.
Credit to @tinp123 for help with Spintend antics, setting up the remote in VESC tool was not working, thank you
Right on queue a 6396 slips and snaps a magnet… Very glad I have the 63100s ready I’m doing laps of a really nice track and there are some others competing casually soon, granted these still worked it just took a bit more throttle and made a bit more noise.
I wonder how much the 170kv 63100s are good for now that they are exceptionally well battle hardened. The 63100 stator is surprisingly 20mm longer.
(keywords for ppl googling) 63100 flipsky 6396 Maytech stator windings size dimensions length 55mm and 75mm.
I was running 90A (maybe 100 earlier on), Maytech rates them in 170/190kv to 80A and these are 210kv so I should have been really fine max torque wise.
The belts are crazy loose, it’s on a track, I’m 60kg with gear, they are 18cm above the ground, I didn’t exceed 40kph so light work and no real impacts.
I was using the 63100s for the first time and got 23km of track time before one jammed. I was not reaching full throttle or more than 50kph. My 16yo ass can’t even put 16S 63100s through their paces yet (also a torn up jacket hurts more than road rash imo)
Thankfully it wasn’t a magnet shearing through the battle hardening of the strongest highest temp epoxy adhesive I could find, just some shards from under a dent in the can.
Is there something I don’t understand about abs overcurrent? I think most people here use slow abs but < 2x motor current. Since I didn’t even notice when one side threw an abs fault, I thought for the VESC safety rather have it high relative to motor current but still a number the VESC would manage in actual motor current. I would hugely appreciate some help on current settings like what to do for abs faults, and current limits. Thank you in advance
If you are getting abs faults it means that your vesc pushed 180 phase amps while your motor current max is 90 so something is seriously wrong(probably wrong observer settings). I have flipsky 6374 170kv and i im pushing 100 phase amps. I am using mxlemming lamda comp observer and doing motor detection with 400μs from the foc tab. You have to do this for both motors. If you are pushing your motors to the max, lower the inductance by 1 or 2 points. You can also check that your motor parameters are wright with this guide MP2-ESC/docs/MOTOR_PARAM.md at main · badgineer/MP2-ESC · GitHub
If you don’t want to mess with these settings you can get some encoders https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJPn-aENL2Q
Also check my vesc tips and tuning thread
That is really helpful thank you. Just what I was looking for. Is it the VESC trying to control current with rpm and overshooting that causes OC faults? In which case is ramp time and pid tuning useful?
Sorry I’m not sure what this part means especially, like lamda comp observer and does changing motor settings before running detection change the result?
I think messing with those settings looks a bit too complicated for me. I can mount and wire an encoder easily if it’s not too difficult to setup and it would solve those issues like tuning would.
I think the detection results look right if anything suspiciously identical, would a factory reset help?
Most of the time oc faults happen because the esc can’t estimate the correct motor position . If you choose a lamda comp observer(flux linkage observer) the esc will track your motor better when it gets saturated.
Changing motor settings before detection doesn’t change the results. You can do motor detection from the foc,general tab. Use 400μs for time constant and then press RL->λ->apply and write motor settings. You have to do it for both motors. Also update to the latest vesc firmware.
With an encoder you can track the motor perfectly .
Also check your battery connectors and phase wires connectors. They might cause oc faults if they are loose. And make sure they are adequate for the amps you are pushing
Thanks again, I got the motor detection done that way, the other motor is very similar. To double check do I detect RL, detect λ, apply and close or “calculate KP, KI and λ“ as well?
The wiring is on the upper end, 8awg battery leads 8mm bullets, 5.5mm bullets on motor wires. I don’t know if I can update a V1 Spintend it’s on 5.02 at the moment. If I knew how to wire an encoder here I would do it.
Does perfectly tracking the motor mean abs over current spikes negligibly larger than actual motor current, which would significantly improve max motor current?
I don’t use the mobile app ,on the desktop vesc tool it automatically calculates the kp, ki values but maybe on the mobile tool you have to press the calculate kp button. It is better to use the desktop version
You have to update to 6+ vesc firmware to get the new observers.
Perfectly tracking the motor means that you always send the current at the right angle. So you get more torque and less current spikes. I haven’t tried an encoder but you can definitely use them with spintend. You have to connect them at the comm port, the one with 5V,VCC etc . The best encoder for vesc is a sin/cos encoder, check Vedders video . And check that your firmware supports sin/cos
Huge thanks for the help, I was 1234km out of BT range for a while. I haven’t had ABS overcurrent faults since doing the different motor detection but I haven’t pushed current or ridden much.
New trucks from Alankerr. The turning is sooo much better I didn’t know how much I was missing out on with some of the hardest bushings available.
But this thing is living up to the title of being big and being a mess. It needs lot of work to be *neat and it’s turning slightly left, but at least it’s shiny.
I sadly think a low angled soft bushing esk8 with an underslung double stack battery is not suitable for anything off track while having a standing platform a single digit number of cm above the ground. I can’t even pick up the front without dragging motors
I want to go to those Trampa 200x75 slicks which will get me the extra centimetre of ground clearance and lasercut pictured gears but I have a lot left in these tires so I can’t justify it
I love hill climbs going past 11pm, there are sometimes no cars at all. I was taking a video of a temporary light for future reference when it failed which was scary. I had to use my phone’s torch to get home it was really pitch black.
I wired 2 still temporary €6 12-85v lights from Temu until I make something nice with Nichia 519A. To help avoid fines I got a red led strip and strategically manoeuvred some spare aluminium bar out of school for the tail light.
I went on a trip with the family often towing someone. I had a speed wobble <40 kph I need advice for, same thing happens on tarmac at higher speeds. Angles 32f20r, 3DS finality trucks, 330mm between wheels, 95cm wheelbase, quite soft bushings outer position in the back and inner position + washer for preload on the front. Hangers oriented offset inwards. Top of deck raised to 10cm above ground. I know it’s not as relevant but tyre pressure was super low to get rid of vibrations. (low enough to spin the tire and tube separately around the hub)
I feel like it’s the front that’s wobbling and inner position back outer position front is what it needs which is unusual. And I think it’s a skill issue rather than setup I haven’t had many miles esk8ing and have never met another esk8er or longboarder the technique could easily be whack.
So basically the question is- Is the riding really weird like should I bend my knees more, should I put the bushings further apart or use more preload, how should front vs back vary is mixed in / out position bad?
In addition to the twats comments above, only fuck with one bushing at a time while adjusting and start with the front if that’s where you feel the wobz are coming from. I like a decent bit of preload. Always good to keep riding on an edge / carving vs trying to balance beam and ride straight. Bushing feedback is what makes you feel connected to the board.
Y’all I really need some help. I moved the front bushings to the outer position and had a speed wobble low 40s kph, didn’t manage to control or run off this time.
My ass is sore, m5 screws tore out through the aluminium taillight, front truck has a gash, deck has a gash AND MY FVCKING MOTORS STARTED SPINNING BACKWARDS
I’m afraid I’m gonna find a bicycle and take my kWs elsewhere.
Setup details
Angles 32f20r, 3DS finality trucks, 330mm between wheels, 95cm wheelbase. Hangers oriented offset inwards. Top of deck raised to 10cm above ground. I’m so low I’m destroying the cf enclosure on decent roads. There’s no unusual looseness. I’m using 60A bushings in the outside position, (I know 60A is very low normally, these are those really tall barrels 70A is really hard). Maybe I should use the inside position and stack washers for preload? Or harder bushings and bindings?
If anyone has some thoughts dw if it’s not that helpful or relevant I’m all ears. Again I think it’s probably a skill issue, or maybe I’m greedy wanting 40s kph to be stable and 50s manageable (24/31mph) while still being able to make it around a roundabout for cars.
Getting this figured out would be an awesome birthday present!
Well I ride Finality trucks at 40 km/h all the time without issues, so there has to be something else… What helped me a lot was to balance the wheels, it made everything a lot more stable…
Keep front bushings inside position. As a rule of thumb you should make sure that if you push the edge of the deck down with one feet (other feet standing on the ground) then the front feels softer than the back. I am guessing with outside outside at such a split angle this is no longer the case. The front should feel considerably softer than the rear.
Furthermore there’s the inherent progressiveness of channel trucks and the lack of bushing options, so unfortunately the tuning you can do is fairly limited. Don’t expect channel trucks to turn on a dime, but being able to go through a roundabout shouldn’t be an issue once setup well.
Also, counterintuitively, having your trucks set too tight can make falling because of a wobble more likely. On tight trucks, you cannot really do much if a wobble does occur. Loose trucks (especially in the front) make wobbles significantly easier to ride out and stay in control, but you still need practice and familiarity of how your setup feels on the edge.
Also, if possible, don’t go in a straight line if possible, but keep doing very elongated carves, it will keep your bushings more engaged and give you more stability.
Having 50s safely manageable was not something that I could tune my channel trucks to do, even with a large angle split. Having low 40s comfortable for cruising already required me to make a little bit of compromise on my turning. On Dualities with WFB I can cruise 60-65 and peak into the low 70s on my raceboard, while being able to turn on a dime. And if I do wobble (which has only happened after I put new bushings in, broke them in so they got a little shorter, and I didn’t retighten to my ideal preload) then I can just ride out wobbles easily.
Honestly, I suggest trying to find an empty parking lot with a usable surface, grab some decent protective gear, throw out some cones, and do some racing practice. Setup the cones in a way that it limits your top speed to something you are comfortable at. T-race is great especially without much experience if you have the space, if not just get creative with the cones. Setup your trucks so that you can do relatively tight turns. Investing in a racebox is worth it especially if you can setup the same track over multiple sessions. Then just practice without pushing yourself way over the limit. Do not move to tires with short sidewalls or tires with stiff sidewalls until you are comfortable with how taller and softer sidewall tires feel on and above the grip limit. It’s fun, it will teach you how the limits of the board feel, and improve your riding skills immensely which means riding in traffic and sketchy conditions will be safer.
Totally agree here, before i got the singularity bushings on my matrix 3s i was running the softest (white) blocks on the inner position front and back but changed the preload in the back depending on if i was solo or trying to keep up with EUC riders. I was also running 40front 25rear angles
Whenever i had the bushings in the outside position i could feel resonances build up and the amount of force needed when the blocks were in the outside position to dampen and kill wobbles is too much without bindings. The board could just jump out from under you. With the innermost position you are at a better point of leverage and the force you impart is higher so the forces created in a wobble resonance are closer to something you can overcome.
Taking that another step to singularity bushings or duality trucks - the bushings are centered and though they do impart resistance, the amount of force you impart carving and turning is significantly more than the bushings can create in a wobble resonance.
Counterintuitively loose trucks save lives. Also it feels great once you get the muscles used to it. I like as little preload in the front as possible to keep the bushings/blocks positioned and happy, a a little more in the rear until you can just feel the asymmetry of it with your feet. It kinda puts you in a slightly weight forward position which is more stable and takes speed better.
(also a torn up jacket hurts more than road rash imo)
