Split Decision | 4WD IDEA Split Angle Build

Decided to finally make a build thread after years of pissing around making random other boards, so here it is - the cumulative efforts of all my prior builds and being annoyed with their performance. It’s still a work in progress, so ill try and regularly update this thread.

BOARD PORN





THE PREMISE
I absolutely had to have split angles, and a stupidly low standing platform. Over the years, i’ve realized the low standing platform of drop bracket boards is something I enjoy the handling feel of, and split angles significantly increased my confidence at speed. It’s a combination i seriously suggest everyone should try. I also wanted the board to be relatively rail matched, as my experience with insanely wide trucks like BN270s, BN280s, and Bioboards RKP 300s has led me to prefer narrower setups - in general, wide setups felt more sluggish on turn in response as well as just being bulkier to deal with on a daily basis. Lastly, i wanted to get away from larger pneumatic wheels and build this board for thane wheels or BRP’s, for the more “direct” road feel - and my lacroix nazare is right there if i want something more comfortable for long range cruising anyways. And lastly, this board has to be built with no expenses spared, and zero compromises. I’m tired of building something and being unhappy with it because i cheaped out or didn’t hold things to my standards. I don’t care how long it’ll take - this board is gonna be done right the first time.

THE DECK
With that being said, the first step was figuring out the deck - I partnered with @IDEA to have a set of split angle brackets made to my specification, which is shown in more detail in this thread (IDEA Split Angle Brackets Group Buy), but the end result was spending $400 on a one off run for a +10/-10 bracket with 45mm of effective drop when run in a drop through configuration. Those, paired with a stiffer IDEA deck gave me the perfect base to build everything else off of. Low, sleek, shiny, and very lightweight for what it offers.

The Most Expensive Millimeters You'll Ever Pay For






THE TRUCKS
So, with my prior experience with RKP trucks being pretty mediocre and uninspiring, i decided to try out a set of TKP trucks awhile ago on my pushboard (a loaded fathom). Me being me though, regular Surf Rodz TKP’s just weren’t shiny enough. Hence, the advent of the @IDEA Surf Rodz TKP 180 and 150 hangers, narrower than his prior 220 or 260 offerings, and also introducing the option to flip the hanger on the bushing seat to change the effective rake and ride height. Additionally, these hangers use a stronger M8 bolt rather than M6, and are full billet aluminum. The initial plan was to use 180mm hangers on this board to keep it as narrow as possible, however i pretty quickly realized that i wouldn’t be able to do this, for reasons you’ll see in the next category, so this board is on a set of his 220 hangers. Still relatively narrow, and plenty shiny enough for me. And of course, @RipTideSports bushings and pivot cups all around.

Shiny Stuff Goes Here






THE DRIVETRAIN
So, with my preference of thanes or BRP’s, and me wanting the ability to fine tune the drive ratio, as well as the recent use of thane belts courtesy of @Tony_Stark (he makes some great shit), the choice there was pretty obvious, despite my prior experience with the bioboards 4:1 helical cut steel gear drives being positive. So, to cover as many gear ratios as physically possible, i went with the @Boardnamics press fit wheel pulleys in both 36 and 44T, as well as designing my own 53T set as shown here (Interest check for >50T wheel pulleys compatible with BN/SR125). This combined with motor pulleys in 15, 16, 18, and 20T gives me the ability to select from ten different ratios, all the way from 1.8:1 to 3.53:1. For motor mounts, i had to go with the @IDEA mounts, and i have a couple choices here, his idler mounts or the shorter ones. For the time being, it looks like i’ll be using the idler mounts in the rear and the short mounts up front. Lastly, to allow for the use of BRP’s, i’m going to be making my own wheel hubs that use the Radium SR125 interface, to be compatible with my 53T pulleys.

The spinny bits






THE MOTORS
With this build being 4wd and performance oriented, the choice was obvious to go with Reachers - My prior experience with 7490s and 6485s from @Skyart has been excellent. The initial plan was to go 6455 and mount them inboard to keep things as tucked away and stealthy as possible - however, this was not possible due to clearance issues, even with wider 220 hangers. Since i was going to have to run the motors outboard mounted, there wasn’t really a reason to stick to 180 hangers, so i decided to make the change to a slightly wider set of 220 hangers, and larger motors. One RFQ on alibaba later, four 220kv 6475 motors were paid for and on the way.

Six motors into a four motor board later



THE BATTERY
So, while I have owned a HV build before at 18S on my prototype board for testing some actively adjustable baseplates, this board really didn’t need that much juice, and with my constraint of wanting to keep it single stack, it wouldn’t make sense anyways as my only other option would have been 18S3P, which is even less power. So, 12S4P in a single stack configuration it was. At the time, P50B cells weren’t an option, so i went for P45B cells for the minor bump in discharge characteristics and capacity. The battery is done with copper braid and ridiculous 8AWG discharge wires courtesy of @slizer18 , and QS8-S connectors all around for both the front and rear discharge ports. Additionally, a singular loopkey to power both lines simultaneously was installed, with a Perfect Pass QS8-S connector (man, i should have specified that all of the connectors were the nicer perfect pass ones). Overall? One of the nicest batteries i’ve ever owned, i can’t recommend this guy enough for your battery building needs.

The Spicy Pillow





However, that’s not the only option for this board. You’ll notice that the board is planned to use a pair of Makerx D100S’s, despite the battery only being 12S. That’s because this board has to fill multiple roles for me. It’s gotta be a nice everyday cruiser, more practical than my Nazare, while also being a monster on track… Hence, multiple battery options. The 12S4P will be for everyday riding and cruising, and i’ll switch to a higher voltage Lipo setup for racing. Hence, buying way too many Ovonic 6400mah 3S lipos. These were picked as they’re stupid thin and fit in an SS enclosure. So, six of them in series gets me an 18S setup that should be able to output some stupid amperage. I still need to make the discharge and charge wiring harnesses, but hey - the option is there.

The Spicier Pillow

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THE ELECTRONICS
So, as i mentioned before, this board is using a pair of Makerx D100S’s. Why? Because they’re some of the slimmest VESC’s on the market, and due to the way the IDEA platform has drop brackets mounted, the drop brackets take up a ton of volume inside the enclosure unless you mount the ESC underneath the brackets, so i needed a really thin VESC. Additionally, from what i can tell the D100S has a pretty potent power output all things considered, and my DV6S inside my Nazare has been putting in solid work. To help deal with thermals, I’ll be getting a sheet of copper lasercut to the D100S mounting pattern and thermally adhering it to the drop brackets, using the entire thing as a huge heatsink, without looking like one. For the remote, i’m still deciding between my old reliable, the Spintend UNI1, or the fancier choice, my Flipsky VX4 with the 3DS thumbwheel mod. Who knows, i like them both. Lastly, i’ll be purchasing a Voyage Systems Megan, as i absolutely adore having telemetry onboard like my Davega display on my Nazare. The only other thing i’m considering for the future use is adding active brake lights, and maybe some built in ambient lighting - buuut that’s a problem for future me.

Don't let the magic blue smoke out

ALL THE OTHER FANCY PARTS
So, while everything else is pretty nice already, that alone just isn’t enough. This board needs more shiny shit on it. So, what did i do? Full titanium hardware. Everywhere. Almost every single bolt or nut on this board is titanium, so it will never rust, and weighs approximately one pubic hair less than it otherwise would have. Some of the more special things? Titanium anti sink plates, titanium kingpin bolts, and titanium wheel locknuts. Additionally? The regular eboosted SS enclosure just isn’t nice enough. It’s also ever so slightly too shallow to fit the VESC under the drop brackets. So? I’ll be 3d printing my own mold and doing a carbon fiber layup to make my own custom SS enclosure for the board. One other thing? One of the bigger projects i worked on last, was a prototype truck system to allow for active baseplate angle adjustment. I want to revise that to slim it down and make it a lot more practical, for this board. It’s gonna be a long and expensive project to do, the last one cost me over a thousand dollars to make, but it showed some serious promise. Lastly? I’m tired of all of our boards having the equivalent of an open diff and performing like crap because of it. I’m gonna try and devise some sort of mechanical limited slip differential between the adjacent motor cans.

THE COMPLETE(ISH) LIST
So, this is the total list of pretty much any of the major expenses i can think of on this project so far. There’s definitely some stuff missing, most of the smaller items and random materials for example, but it should account for the vast majority of things. Thank god that the first year salary for a mechanical engineer is decent enough i can afford to do this.

I swear, ramen tastes great man, it's got all the nutrients i need

So yeah, this is what i’ve been working on for the past few months in my freetime, dumping basically all of my extra money into haha. It’s taught me a lot about part design as a fresh mechanical engineering graduate, and it’s been nice to have somewhere to apply my engineering knowledge and hands on knowledge.

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Sick AF

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It’s awesome to see all the work you’ve done on this board written up in one place.

I deeply feel this right now, as much as I want to cobble shit together in the hopes of being able to take it for a ride. I’m grumpily spending my time building a proper board.

Hyped to see how this turns out!

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Thanks haha. Ive been meaning to do a build thread on one of my boards for awhile, but they never felt quite polished enough. Images for context

All of my other shitty DIY















Also, here’s the last version of the enclosure design. Needs a lot of work, as i didn’t realize the IDEA deck isn’t symetrical front to back haha.





Hell yeah, happy for you! Manifest the board of your dreams.

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Any experience doing layups before?

Also, considered fiberglass over CF? Cheaper, easier to work with, and better for receiver signal integrity (especially with a CF deck)

Yep, i recently taught myself wet lay CF work for my campus FSAE team. Could be cleaner, but considering i had to pick this project up from scratch and finish everything from the nosecone shape/design, to making the mold, to doing the actual carbon layup and then painting in something like 3 weeks, not too bad. Chances are i’ll fuckup the first enclosure because it’s a bit more complex of a shape and i’m trying to do vac bagging instead of just pure wet lay, but it’s cheap enough to do i’m okay with trying it.





As for CF vs fiberglass - as before, this is a no expenses spared build, and this enclosure needs to be stupid tough with how low the board will be haha. Plus, i get my carbon fiber from china for around $16/square meter. As for signal integrity, im actually not worried at all about that - ill be routing the receicer outside of the enclosure to somewhere ontop of the rear drop bracket most likely.

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Impressive for 3 weeks! Excited to see what you make.

+1 for vacuum bagging. I did a bunch of rocket fins and a 6ft model plane wing using a food saver

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First random update for this build thread - the 53T pulleys are (i think) finalized. Also working on trying to get the custom BRP racing hubs done. Next thing after those two is just buying the second D100S, and then the enclosure.

As a side note, if anyone has recommendations for a good affordable benchtop mill or lathe, i am all ears - trying to get into milling my own parts for smaller projects.

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i can personally recommend an old southbend heavy 10 lathe. if your in america there everywhere and replacement bits are easy enough to find

What’s the budget / weight you are considering? Obviously there’s a tradeoff between that and the parts you are able to make but you probably know that already.

Not sure if it’s even possible to get them shipped to the US, but I am saving up for an FS4MG. It’s a mineral casting frame with high quality components, roughly 5-6k$ for the mechanical kit plus shipping, I don’t know if it’s possible to get it shipped to the US though. Probably the most capable benchtop you can find. You gotta source your own electronics but that’s not too hard.

FS4MG price list

If you can leave the benchtop formfactor behind there’s the MR1 which is very capable for the price you pay, may be worth considering
https://www.langmuirsystems.com/mr1

If you are looking for something lighter duty maybe you could look at the omio router lineup as well. Not quite a mill but I heard the quality is decent.

There’s also the millenium milo v1.5, don’t know much about it but probably worth looking into. 1.5k ish and benchtop

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For the time being it doesnt even need to be CNC, was more looking for a manual mill and lathe that i can slap a DRO onto for simpler parts haha. Probably 2-3 grand for both? Would be open to shopping used too.

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Now this is one fantastic build thread. I too absolutely love the split angled decks.

I’m def down for the BRP pulleys but fuck it, mark me down for a set of 53’s also - I assume we can take those finer details to pm yeah ?

You certainly have skillz - that’s for sure.

Great build, with the detailed thought process behind it makes this a top quality read

11/10

:metal:

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So, another update for this build. Im picking up a used mill and lathe combo (Grizzly G9729) this weekend, so that should help a lot with prototyping or making custom parts. Ive also managed to partner with boardnamics to bundle my 53T pulleys with the wheel adapters so that should hopefully drum up some more interest to help fund other custom parts :rofl:

Next step is gonna be buying some round stock aluminum and prototyping the BRP hubs to fit those 53T pulleys, and maybe some better idler pulleys.

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This build thread is gonna turn into “what manner of stupid side project is ac53n up to today”, but fuckit - new mill and lathe acquired

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Hells yeah dude, that’s the dream. I’m in an NYC studio apt, so i have to live vicariously through people who are able to get machining equipment.

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I’ll definitely be posting updates on my experience learning to run the lathe and mill haha, so hopefully you’re able to get a kick out of that.

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So, next update!

The IDEA deck platform is amazing, but enclosure options are a bit sparse, besides the eboosted ones, which are great - however, i have some gripes with them. The SS enclosure is too shallow for me to comfortably put an esc underneath the brackets, and the DS enclosure is thicker than i need. So? I’ve been working on developing my own enclosure in between SS and DS thickness, as well as taking up more of the available surface area. Hopefully, this will let me run the two VESC’s and give me decent space for batteries in there in the future, while still having somewhat reasonable ground clearance.

So, with the reasoning aside - A couple months ago i started modeling the first version of this enclosure, and the associated 3d printed mold.




However, those with a sharp eye might realize that i didn’t account for the IDEA deck actually being different front to back, and not symetrical. Ontop of this, it’s a very complex shape for no real reason at all, and would generally just be really annoying to do carbon fiber layup on. So? I’ve been wanting to re-do this model for quite some time. With that, i finally present, the much simpler version two of this enclosure.



Also, after some more experience working with carbon fiber, i don’t think i need to make a negative mold - Instead, i’ll be directly printing the positive form, and then laying carbon fiber over top of that. Hopefully, i’ll be able to get a relatively decent surface finish with the epoxy on the exterior still, and if not - well, i can either add extra epoxy and then cut down, or i can design a negative mold for this design and go through that again.

So, what’s left? Well, waiting for my bulk order of filament to come in, optimizing the form for 3d printing (as it has to be done in sections, even on my huge neptune 4 max printer), and then sorting out all the carbon fiber layup materials i’ll need to order more of. The only other things i’m considering doing for this enclosure design are

  • Integrating 3d printed flanges in between layers of the carbon layup, to increase strength there and provide some more stiffness than the otherwise thin carbon layup would have
  • Integrating some ribbing along the bottom of the enclosure for some steel rails, so that i’d scrape those, and not the carbon enclosure itself (this board is going to be pretty low)
  • Possibly integrating some 3d printed cable passthroughs on the front and rear for some fancy panel mounted motor connectors (superflux connectors?, but god help me if i have to spend $280 on just connectors)
  • 3d printing a holder of sorts for the QS8 loopkey and charge port.
  • The possibility of using some sort of automotive quick release pins instead of bolts, if i can source any small enough.

Also, as a side note on the mill and lathe, i think it’s AC contactor gave up, so i’ve ordered a replacement part for that, and will be redoing the wiring (grizzly industrial is AWESOME, and they gladly sent me the wiring schematics for everything involved)

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