Cooling Direct Drives

If you were to go to all that trouble, you might as well embed some heatpipes in there - better thermal conductivity.

I think you’d end up with problems regarding eddy current drag and losses in the indium monoliths though. That’s another issue with my coolant-filled-can-around-the-stator idea too - any container passing between the stator and the magnets has to be nonconductive and magnetically transparent otherwise you’ll have issues.

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We’re talking about the same things here lmao. Before you apply theres no connection, after there is.

Yes :+1: I do appreciate the long response but read what I said and save yourself the time

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sure eddy currents but theyre in everything else conductive around, which is everything, except not so much the stator, and being such a slow turning motor they are not much.

heatpipes that are actually hollow and all seem more trouble to make, still would produce eddies, and more fragile than a solid soft metal that would encase the stator, and heatpipes work ideally sending heat up instead of sideways.

im trying it
a pipe would only be able to get to some of the heat while a stator that was potted you could get to all the heat. even if with more eddies I think the benefits of keeping heat down would outway in overall efficiency.

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Heat pipes works in whatever direction, take for example any type of computer, notebooks, video games, etc, all have heat pipes and doesn’t matter the orientation

They should provide way more heat transfer than any solid material

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where would you put the pipe? where would it take heat from and what would it contact? you could have a beautiful pipe…but it’s only going to be able to touch a small portion of the windings. to get a heatpipe to transfer sideways with wicking its a complicated device in comparison. If it was going to be able to access heat on all the windings it sounds extra complicated vs a silicone mold with liquid indium I can drop a motor hub with a stator on it into and vacuum.

But it’s just an idea and maybe the eddy currents will be more than I think. I’m more thinking the problem would be thermal expansion and breaking down of the magnet wire insulation or possibly even an epoxy layer id put on the windings first.
Definitely will try it

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This is the exact kind of post that would get you banned from the old builder’s forum.

This is an interesting idea, following this thread

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I was thinking of potting the heatpipes in indium (or maybe metal-loaded/thermal epoxy? that would solve the eddy current issue.) My idea was to have the heatpipes exit the motor and go to the truck and/or heatsinks. A well-designed heatpipe can have a thermal conductivity of 2-2,000+x that of a bar of solid copper the same shape and size.

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This ^^^

Basically it radiates the heat away from core (stator) like thermal wipers (lick, lick, lick) toward the can (rotor with magnets) then your hubsinks cool down your can pretty efficiently (like a high speed fan) right?

Actually I’d need to try make something with this later, don’t know how yet to deal my motors tho.

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I don’t think they move the heat to the can/rotor, but to the truck hanger or somewhere with a hard connection to the stator. Maybe I understand wrong

This I have the solution for you my friend :beer:

Use the flange directly, stuff it with aluminum + holes for your heatpipes. Press your stator with windings against it + add thermal pads or thermal compound before pressing. Voilà, your copper windings radiate towards your heatpipes.

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Actually for the statorade it does, I recall a pic taken with a thermal camera showing the hot zones without statorade and with statorade :

A classic motor has super hot core and it stays pretty concentrated (tho with saturation everything comes down at some point)

A statorade filled one has a hot can instead (fluid sucks the heat away) so that’s where the hub sink fins play there rôle.

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just wondering, but has anyone ever tried putting holes in the can so more air can get in & out? :thinking:

It’s been done, but there are many potential drawbacks, the main one being susceptibility to dust and debris, being so close to (inside!) a rolling wheel, and thus very close to the dust it kicks up. That dust and debris will get in the motor, some will stick to the magnets, and some will get into the bearings, damaging both over time.

Holes in and of themselves don’t really add much airflow unless you have some kind of impeller or scoop or other device to force airflow through the stator - it’s mostly full of copper and laminations, lots of restriction of airflow.

Also the surface area isn’t that big and air is a lousy conductor of heat.

All in all, it doesn’t help that much, and can actually hurt instead.

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Mine get super hot. The issue isn’t necessarily with the hanger not absorbing enough heat from the motors, but radiating it away is the hard part. there’s not much surface area so adding what you can is the best way to get rid of it. Kind of how TB went with the ridges on the cans and fins on the hanger.

Funny joke I never really thought adding that heat sink would help at all. Maybe it does, just a tiny bit.

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What about a hollow stator that has threaded barbs at the end, allowing for fluid to be piped in and out, to some sort of radiator? The hollow stator would mean that the heat is transfered directly into the coolant, and using the stator as piping would mean no eddy currents.
Then its up to a persons imagination as to how to keep the coolant cool

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That sounds like it would significantly reduce efficiency though and it might all just leak out under heavy vibration and an unsealed can/rotor.

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Well yea it is definitely not suited for unsealed cans as you pointed ; however for efficiency it’s the contrary, there’s a sweet spot of liquid qty to pour in order not to add drag to the motor and by running the motors cooler you can just squeeze more power per watt from your windings.

The outer fins on cans are doing a pretty good job at keeping the can and magnets steady too. Now it works great on e bikes with big diameters and big cooling surfaces, results won’t be as significative with our tiny motors (and obviously tiny fins)…

Tho it would be also good for geared motors, more space for bigger /longer fins.

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well, that explains the homeless guy who wizzed past me at 30 mph

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Ferrofluid seems a proven passive cooling method. An active cooling method, unless it ran on the motor somehow itself, which would be awesome, is a big complication and probably break knowing eskate

Pouring water on I think would be dangerous with the extreme change in heat and stress the magnet glue, but maybe not and I think diy direct drive aren’t using glue on the magnets and instead a pressed retainer holding the magnets,no? Like to see. In my experience getting similar small aluminum parts machined was shockingly expensive. How much space do they take

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Depending the size of your stator you have some mass relief holes, they would be perfect to run water through, the problem is that with the motor sized we use it would mean less copper in the motor

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