Oh man, I am going through this right now. Still unclear if we can get 3-phase power, so there is a good chance I will need a phase converter. The well-reviewed units with good warranties start at like $4k 
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I had to use phase converters years ago. I think you just need a motor twice the HP of the spindle motor, and a good qualified electrician. Oh wait, you are close to @Skyart correct?
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Yep, that is what I have read. If the 3-phase drop isn’t an option, we will need a 40hp converter.
Yes, I am 
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A budget of around 3000 euros will not get you much further than one of those extrusion based cnc routers.
The only other way I could see it is if you had a huge shop with machines at your disposal such that you could DIY something reasonable. Even then, DIY CNC’s are typically not a good route for the vast majority of people. Machine tool builders are good at what they do.
I’d say at close to $10k is where you start getting more options.
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Size of linear rails and ball screws, spindle, stepper motors, gantry plates to my eyes at least, all look mostly comparable. The gantry of the ratrig stronghold pro looks a little beefier than the omio x8 and the bed of the omio looks beefier than the ratrig.
They don’t ship to Europe.
The omio would be about 4.5k$ once it arrives here (600$ shipping 900$ tax). Is it worth that much? Especially compared to the 3k€ ratrig?
I am willing to increase the budget if that means that I will get a much more capable machine, but I still can’t go up to 10k. Probably around 5-6k€ for the machine itself and 2k€ for tooling is the absolute max. Getting some of the non critical tooling later than the initial investment.
That’s kind of how I originally intended to start out. Just getting a CNC for personal projects and maybe upgrading machines and starting manufacturing after an year or two of experience. But my circumstances have changed (I am no longer satisfied with my workplace) so I want to create another source of income as well just incase shit goes south. Don’t need to make too much money though, a couple hundred per month is going to be more than enough for the long term. And I will also be building batteries which is an easier investment to get into financially (and there I already have the experience), but this kind of accelerated my plans regarding the CNC as well. I plan to ease into it though, gradually increasing the difficulty of the parts I machine. For example starting with motor mounts will be fairly easy. I am positive that I can make something within 3 months or so of owning the machine. I am a quick learner.
Yeah I want to stick to a single phase. If I go to too high power levels I will need to build a UPS anyways though, and then 3 phase might not be that much extra cost
I see. Then getting it into my workshop might be a bit of an issue unless the thing comes disassembled or can be partially disassembled relatively painlessly. Well I might really need to rent another workshop… I’ve been wanting to for a while but it’s just so hard to find anything locally that’s smaller than 300 m^2 while I only need 20-30 m^2
Also if I buy a used mill I need to be able to lift it up one way or another to get it into my trailer.
I’ve made my mind up about the form factor. Something in the size of the MR1 or an Tormach PCNC 440 would be ideal then. I just need to find one that fits within my budget of 5-6k€ max. Either new or used. There ain’t no way I can fit an old industrial powerhouse in my workshop
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I’ve just came across this machine:
There doesn’t seem to be a lot of information around it at first glance so I will look into it more tomorrow. Mainly I want to know how much more do I have to spend on it to have a complete machine… Comes without spindle, stepper motors, and control electronics. The frame seems pretty solid though. What do you think? @Boardnamics @SabreDynamics @Savage1
Seems like a step up in hardware, but I still think a bigger router is a better “first machine”. Lots of ways to make money with them such as sign making or producing large sheet goods.
A ton of people I know who started machining based business started with a CNC router. They’re inexpensive, accurate enough for a TON of jobs, and ease to operate. They also require much less maintenance I have found, and run off of standard single phase.
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Hmm I’ll have to think about keeping it at a simple router. The thing is, that at my current place I don’t think I can afford to fit two machines, unless one of them is a small “desktop machine”. I have around 15m^2 total. I actually really like the size of this machine. Large enough for 98% of the stuff I want to make, but doesn’t take up too much space either. The price is a bit on the steeper side though. And I not only want to make money with it, but also make alu parts for my own use. Also I am not really “passionate” to make signs. I know many people do it. I don’t know what would set me apart.
Maybe the best option would be if I got myself a small relatively inexpensive mini router to start out learning with. And once I have a bit more saved up get something like the sorotec that I linked? In that case, I really don’t want to waste much money on the first machine though. But also don’t want to get something useless. Tough question if I want to go this route. I’ll need to think about it
I’m a sign guy and I used to run a 50x100” router table to do simple v-groove cutting or cutting aluminum shapes for various signs and such. You don’t have to be a sign guy yourself - the best thing to do is reach out to local sign companies all around the area and let them know you have the capability to cut sheets of (whatever). Then just have them drop off raw stock and charge per job. I used to do a ton of that for other shops in my area. I used to cut MDF shapes for a local custom furniture company too that they would use for forms and such. Lots of oddball ways to make $ with it that are a bit outside the norm.
Anyways, great thread and lots of good reading. A dream of mine is to have a machine for this kind of stuff, so for now I’ll live vicariously through you
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I wanted to chime in about the things that you can make with a CNC router with regards to skateboards. I have a 24" x 48" machine. It’s a pretty heavy duty router with a cooled spindle which makes it so it can work all day long (and night). It cost about $11K with software and a bunch of toys.
I make heatsinks and anti-sinks with it all of the time, as well as some other basic aluminum parts. I get a lot of use from my router with wood.
I make large molds for my skateboards using the router. Making large molds requires a good gantry height. This is something to keep in mind. You’ll want 6" or more, otherwise you have to slice the mold up to make it. I also use the router to cut my decks out. That ones kind of obvious, but it does a nice job. Additionally, I use the router to make big two-part molds for making thermoformed enclosures. I use it for making jigs and other stuff as well. The uses are honestly endless. Although, like many people above mentioned, if you want to get serious about aluminum and metal parts, you’ll have to get a mill.
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That’s a great idea! I will do that for sure once I have the machine!
I would love to try doing decks as well, but sadly no place for a press until I move to another place (which I want to, but can’t really find anything that would work).
That’s the goal. But I might start out with the ratrig stronghold pro router and get a mill later on. Or just save up for the sorotec st mill. Will have to think about it more
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I use vacuum presses partly due to limited space. I also like just like them. I can press 3 decks simultaneously with one pump and then fold it all up and put it on a shelf.
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Curious, as to whether the pressure of the bag is enough for a good press of complex shapes. How is your experience with them against a press?
Sorry for derail in advance.
For complex shapes I need to use clamp jigs in addition to the bag.
I’ve just found this machine. Looks killer for the price. What do you think? @Boardnamics @surfnacho
I’m thinking about getting it without the ATC (but it still has pneumatics for quick tool change) and upgrading to the ATC down the line.
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I have seen ads for it. I find it a bit corny and rather unproven/undocumented.
Documentation and support is a huuuge deal when buying a machine. Something like that with virtually no long term users to vouch for it make me nervous.
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